Conversations is an interview series in which we discuss a specific component of an artist’s work.

In this edition, Jeanette Wall chats with Rubblebucket‘s lead vocalist Kalmia Traver about her recent writing retreats, working on the band’s newly released Save Charlie EP, and how the band’s spirit can be found at the core of their songwriting methods.

So this wasn’t the first time you’d been on a writing retreat, right?

Yeah, no, I mean, usually I do them alone. Alex will do them alone. Probably at least once a year for me, but this time we did it together.

You had never done them together?

Well, no, not as a retreat. I mean, we live together, so the potential for collaborating on music is always there, 24/7. But it’s kind of nice to set aside time where we can work, at least for me. That’s just the way my brain works; Alex’s works really differently. He’s constantly writing, it never shuts down for him. His on button is always on. For me, it’s a switch that is either on or off. And that’s actually something that creates tension. But I really like the retreat model, because, for me, it’s kind of like this secret separate place where I can just put my on button on all the time and not feel distracted by anything else. I’ve got a bunch of different art forms, so I think that can be confusing sometimes.

So you find that you work best when you create an environment to focus?

Yeah, even if I’m at home, I’m like, “I’m going to spend this afternoon, and into the night, and devote it all to music.” Well, first I’ve got to clean my room, and I have to wash all the dishes and sweep all the floors, and then light sage, turn off my phone, lock my door. And then I’ll do twenty push ups and meditate for half and hour. And then, maybe, I’ll play sax.

Productive procrastination?

Well, it’s partly procrastination. But it’s also that once I’ve done all that stuff, I really am way more open. I think you need to get in that state to write music, a state where you’re not self-editing all the time. Where you’re saying yes more than no; that’s really, really important for writing. Just not shutting yourself down. So, that’s kind of what I’m going for when I set aside a time and space.

Did you have any specific goals for this particular retreat?

We had specific goals. We got really encouraged by some of the guys at the label. This whole time of our lives, like 2013, has been totally different, unprecedented time of our life, because we haven’t really been touring almost at all. It’s opened up a lot more time to write, and we have been writing and kind of producing music together as a band, and me and Alex. It’s just more volume, quantity. Volume, baby! Turn up the volume! But then Alex was really encouraged by Ben over at Communion when we showed them all the work we’d done. He was like, “This is amazing! Now, go do more of this! Try to bump all your top songs off with newer, better songs.” And that really fit in with Alex’s state of mind. He’s just in the mood to be constantly creating, so he’s been writing a song every single day. That’s been his mission.

How long has he been doing that?

I would say the strict song a day has probably been the past month, I think. So, interspersed with me being really under the weather, my role has been more encouragement, and he bounces ideas off me. And then the real thing I can contribute that’s no sweat off my back is singing. That’s what our goal was for this retreat. I was laying down vocals for all of the song-a-days that he wanted to. We were getting together all the demos. We’re working really progressively, methodically, just polishing them off and cleaning them off. It’s like buttoning down, little by little.

Where did you decide to go for the retreat? Why did you decide to go there?

Well, after I got my first chemo, I went to Vermont. I just knew I needed to get out of the City, that was the week after. So once I was well enough to go anywhere. And I spent a week there, and, actually Alex was in Brooklyn at the time. I wasn’t really intending that to be a retreat, because I just wanted to be in the garden, healing. But this time around, we really wanted to do the retreat. But we wanted to be in nature, too, so we decided to go to his parents’ house in Lambertville, New Jersey. It’s like the part of New Jersey that gives it its name ‘The Garden State.’ It’s really green. That’s what I keep saying, you know, “Get me to the green!”

So, you’ve been writing more frequently as a band. What is your plan of attack whenever you bring these new demos in? What is that process like? How have you done it in the past?

Well, what we’re doing now, as opposed to the past—because we have so much more time, it feels luxurious—we’re just taking out time as a group to produce these things. And we’ve been working with some engineers who are helping us mix and get the sounds we like, and co-producing. We’re seeing these demos as little productions. So, we’ve been setting up sessions. Alex and Ian were working every day for two weeks, kind of doing really intense sessions, and building up the tracks. Adding drum machines or synths or guitar, or even writing and rewriting and changing lyrics.

I guess before we kind of had a bunch of tunes, say for Omega La La. We had about twelve tunes, and then there ended up only being ten or eleven on the album. We had a very limited number of songs, so we did all of our songs. For these, we’ve been playing them live for the past year. It was like, all right, just make them sound good. We got a producer, and just recorded them. With this, it’s so different. Now we have like 30 songs, and it’s just a matter of choosing the ones we like the most, then putting the most into those.

So, how are you choosing which songs you play live on this tour? Are you maybe using the ability to showcase some songs live to choose what you want to put on the record?

Yeah, we’ve been wanting to integrate some of the new stuff. Partly, it’s fun for the audience to hear it and it’s really good practice for us. It’s very illuminating about the song. We learn about the song when we play it. So, we’ve been playing “Save Charlie” and “Patriotic” a lot. We tested “You You,” but that’s kind of down at the bottom of the pile right now.

The first time I ever saw you guys was so long ago. I feel like your music and writing has changed so much, even since the last album. Has that been a conscious choice or did it just sort of happen?

It’s grown so much with us, and it’s changed a lot. I think we’ve been learning and growing, and just changing as people. We’ve always wanted to make music that we like, that we were inspired by, and that we think is good. I guess our concept of what is “good” has been changing. It’s never felt like this was a concept project; it’s kind of the exact opposite of that. Maybe that’s good, maybe that’s bad. In a way, I would love my next project to be a concept project, where I have it all figured out from the beginning. Then it’s just building off something, and it’s very centered. This has just been, “Let’s make music!” from the beginning.

It’s been really fluid.

Yeah, and it’s totally fun. And it just seems to work. We’re not really alienating too many of our fans. All the way through, it’s had our Rubblebucket-y spirit. And that’s kind of almost of the concept. That’s at the center of everything. That sort of indescribable spirit that’s just Rubblebucket.

It’s less about the kind of music, and more about the band as people, perhaps?

It’s just kind of getting the spirit across. It’s always been hard to put us in a genre, but I don’t think that it’s shifted too much. We’ve always been playing dance music, something upbeat, bright, fun. We did intend to be making our music more poppy, and have more songs with formal song structure. A lot of our earlier music was just sprawling, ten minute, sort of funk meditations. We just felt that it was more exciting to write inside classic songwriting structure.

We’ve definitely got this super wacky sense of humor, that’s almost absurdist. I’m really staunch on preserving that, even in the midst of a pop song. And just like, the playful spirit. That’s what my tattoo is on my butt.

What is it of?

It’s a toilet bowl monster with high heels and it’s shooting through the sky. It represents the spirit. It’s a toilet bowl shooting up to the sky, and the caption that goes with it is, “A watch toilet bowl never shoots up to the sky.” It’s just ridiculous.

What does that mean?

It’s just ridiculous. It’s just that playful spirit. It’s at the center of my entire worldview.

I feel like that certainly translates into your music.

I would hope so! I never want to get too serious.

So, you have the Save Charlie EP now. Were those written on a different retreat or were those just songs you wrote at home?

“Patriotic,” actually, I did a retreat earlier. I’ve done a few this year. I went to New Orleans, and did one there. The first month of this year, I spent some time at my parents’ and that song came out of there. And then “Six Hands” actually came around the same time. A lot of the way I work is making these little seeds, and Alex, too. Just like a verse, or a chorus, or a verse and a chorus. Then you record it into Garage Band, or Guitar Band, or whatever. Then whenever I want to work on music, but I don’t have any direct inspiration, I open all my files and I find some old seed. Then I start rebuilding that. That’s the way I really like to work, just getting inspired by big volumes of old stuff. Picking all the flowers from all the seeds to make the perfect bouquet.

Do you think the environment that you choose to write in affects what you end up creating? Or is it just the mindset of being out of your apartment?

I think about that more than I should. The bottom line, for me to have an effective writing retreat, or for me to even have a retreat at my home is to just do it every day. Sometimes I go to Vermont to write, and I love it there so much that I just end up going on hikes the whole time, and walking around the garden, and jumping on the trampoline. All that’s really good stuff, but the most important thing for a retreat is to actually shut out the world around you and go inside your brain.

So the specific place, like New Orleans for example, doesn’t excite anything related to the environment?

I think the thing with New Orleans was that is was part inspiration and adventure, and then part writing retreat. I ended up doing a lot of practicing, like everyday I practiced sax and singing and drums. And every single night I went out and drank. But I gained so much from that trip. It’s such a huge part of my life now, just taking weeks to change up your daily patterns. I like having patterns, but it’s not always centered around your life. Like touring, that becomes such a grind.

Do you ever write on tour?

I can’t do that. I’ve this fickle concentration. But we might try and do it a little bit this fall. It’s going to be a lot more spacious, and we have more days off.

Well, you have Save Charlie and the tour. What else is coming up?

This fall is all of that. We’re working on our full length. We’ve been working on it the whole year. We’re going to be recording it early next year and releasing it.